Heavy doubt in the pureland and Amitabha

[Joey]

if it benefits us if we believe then why not? better to get more merit than to get more negative intuitions and inclinations.

it's fun to be skeptical when you arent in the other person's shoes or is willing to do enough research on what is it about. it is not fair to close down something that dosent fit with your expectations.

after all, in the Bodhisattva vows we cant reject a Dharma teaching based on its writing style or literature or when its presentation does not appeal to us.

[SharpPudding]

Meditation is the great medicine. it cannot be wrong!  if you continuously recite mantras...your results will be uncertain. Lodro Thaye said that 1.5 minutes of meditation will help you much more than 10 years of mantras

take care

 Yoshiaki, I have been talking about Dharma for a long time, I have been debating with Lamas for a long time, and one thing you don't do is quote a teacher, especially your teacher, because no one wants to mess with your samaya, but at the same time, we don't know your teacher, so it's not really evidence or proof to us. If you want to debate with many people with different teachers, you have to quote authoritative texts that everyone can say, "yes, that's very convincing because we all know it's in accord with the Buddha Dharma". Quoting your teacher will cause conflicts and even your friends will leave you just to keep from unintentionally distancing you from your teacher. 

[Yoshiaki]

  what do you mean?  but tsem rinpoche said that you have to say where did you get this information from. I cannot make up teachings on my own, ya know.
and about mantras, that great lama said this.

[SharpPudding]

Yoshiaki, Rinpoche no doubt says that, any lineage lama should, it's one of the three things you have to talk about when you give a teaching. The lineage, the benefits, and the practice, some explain how it works too but I don't know if that's necessary.
 
Anyways,.. that great lama would also need to state an authoritative source of his information to use it in debate if it couldn't stand on it's own with logic.

 We look for three main things when we analyze a teaching,... Does it come from Buddha Shakyamuni? Does it accord with the impermanence, suffering, and not self teachings? Is it skillful, leading to happiness now and in the future, praised by the wise?  There's also whether or not it's true, sometimes we can tell it's definitely not, so we throw it out as a teaching, other times we can't tell, so some things we don't wait to find out if it is true because we don't have enough time or it's impossible to tell.

 A lot of teachings today don't come from Shakyamuni directly, but were inspired by him and meet the other necessary criteria, so they are taught in Buddhism, but we shouldn't say Buddha taught them I think.

 I happen to agree with Lodro Thaye though, mantras can be done wrong and have little good effect, but they can be also very powerful. For instance Vajrasattva,.. eh,.. hehe, I'm not you guy's teacher, so nevermind.

[wmw111]

Dear Yoshiaki,
To say mantras is not as effective as meditation may not be all that correct . Mantras can be very powerful and can bring someone to a very calm state of mind if done properly just like how meditation can bring you also to, mantras can make things happen if one really fulfills all the criteria of making chanting very powerful like

i) holding one's vows ( refuge, bodhisattva , tantric) purely,
ii) knowledge of dharma esp karma,
iii) knowledge of accompanying rituals and visualization,
iv) Good motivation,

This is a very good blog article on doing pujas
http://blog.tsemtulku.com/tsem-tulku-rinpoche/2010/06/what-are-pujas-aboutdo-take-a-good-read.html

Of course you may quote a teacher for example however it would be good for you to understand/appreciate the context under which that statement was made . 

[Yoshiaki]

yes, yes,
it will be great to pray for world peace. my lama loved very much to pray for peace.

[Joey]

yes, yes,
it will be great to pray for world peace. my lama loved very much to pray for peace.

In case you missed out, do take a read: http://blog.tsemtulku.com/tsem-tulku-rinpoche/2010/06/what-are-pujas-aboutdo-take-a-good-read.html

[SharpPudding]

 Mantra is not just words. I am thinking about it and I'm not sure if I can separate in my mind mantra from meditation. Mantra is so important, it is the yidam, it's the intention, it's what holds holy pairs together, it's so much,...

 For some people it's just words. It's weird to see people saying mantras that don't mean anything to them because they don't have the teachings and cultivation.

[GonzoEnder]

I watch my mind very carefully. I'm kind of a paranoid person anyway. I notice a fantastic amount of subtle and right up front differences during a day doing my mantras VS. a skipped day of my daily mantra's (shame on me).

I see clear changes in my daily life from mantra's. What more can I say other than I have seen the benefit first hand so I need no one's opinion.

[Joey]

I watch my mind very carefully. I'm kind of a paranoid person anyway. I notice a fantastic amount of subtle and right up front differences during a day doing my mantras VS. a skipped day of my daily mantra's (shame on me).

I see clear changes in my daily life from mantra's. What more can I say other than I have seen the benefit first hand so I need no one's opinion.

exactly my thoughts.

When the opinion comes from someone who has actually did mantras correctly the opinion matters more, than from a person who did  not do it correctly and denounce it.


The thing is, opinions are opinions, but those with less weight should be ignored. In fact, such articles like the thread's topic about the article and the 'research' that went into it was actually made by someone who believed that the Mahayana texts were corrupted with Hinduism, and therefore seek to denounce it. And it is obvious that the author of the article that the thread starter read has intentions of destroying the faith of others in Mahayana. It is equally obvious that the author of that article has not studied any mahayana texts at all but managed to come up with such conclusions.

This is why when i find an opinion that was made out of assumptions and no research (such as the article in the thread topic, for example), i tend to ignore it but since its here i'll clear up the air

[Yoshiaki]

i  have to experience myself to believe.
i doubt that a higher being exist.
it can be just a man made deiti just to control the stupid who believe in it. 
that s why they have vows. you are not the vow

[Joey]

i  have to experience myself to believe.
i doubt that a higher being exist.
it can be just a man made deiti just to control the stupid who believe in it. 
that s why they have vows. you are not the vow

since  you havent your opinions dont matter so you're just wasting your time why post then?

you do know that a Buddha is also a higher being right?