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Author Topic: something to think about  (Read 1025 times)
Joey
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« on: September 14, 2009, 02:53:04 AM »

I have been thinking about this for a while.

When i was younger, something terrible happened to me and i escaped into the world of Dharma books to help me cope with the trauma and eventually i was in my own little fake world based on the "Dharma".  I was deluded, using what i read from Dharma books to make  me happy instead of practicing them, i used them to comfort myself . It made me happy but i was going round in circles in this kind of delusion, until Rinpoche broke that for me and i was back in reality.

now, i question my motivation to learn the Dharma, if it is to make my mind feel better, or really for the Dharma because if the intention was the former, i'd go nowhere or start a new cult sooner or later.

I feel that, i have misused the Dharma to deceive myself from what was going on and i am very ashamed of it. Then i observe that many people in the Dharma also use the Dharma to make themselves happy: they would conveniently ignore and deny certain views or texts or schools of Buddhism that oppose and expose their flawed views of the Dharma and defend what do they think is the Dharma. They would get very agitated when these views were presented to them. I noticed that this was the same with me, that everyone else was using the Dharma to make themselves feel good and not really practice, until I met KH and Rinpoche, who kindly woke me up from that delusion.

My question is, how many of us really wanted Dharma for what it is, and not just because it was spiritual marijuana? And even if we encounter someone like that, how would we help that person? I notice that some of them are here in the forum, perhaps more but still, i dont claim to not use the Dharma as an escape from unhappy moments but what do you think should be done to help those who do?
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wmw111
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« Reply #1 on: September 15, 2009, 02:15:00 AM »

I've always wanted to help people even from young, perhaps its a need on my part to feel that I'm useful for society . Dharma I feel helps me to be more useful.  Is it again feeding one's ego hmm?

Rinpoche did say before I use the Dharma to get back into samsara , crazy huh.

Though dharma does bring us closer to reality , and if we are at peace with reality , we normally do not suffer. A truth is that whenever I' focus on me me me all the time , i feel pain , when I focus on others there is levity however brief .

I can't say much about bodhicitta and enlightenment , I do feel I'm training myself to be better  person , thats spurs me on.  Towards something much bigger than my selfish mind I suppose.

If people are only on trips , we need to be at the level or developed spiritually enough, to help them see through it .  Hence we all need to grow.
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spiritnoname
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« Reply #2 on: September 15, 2009, 02:31:52 PM »

 People like to day dream about themselves to feed off this kind of view of who they like to think they are, if they practice long enough they'll realize that that kind of view is unfulfilling, a waste of energy, incorrect, and serves as a obstacle to worthwhile activities. The people who's self identity leads them to dharma practice are just more fortunate than the people who establish themselves as rich, or poor, heros, victims, smart, dumb, sick, healthy, and all other variants who not only waste their lives playing a role but have major turmoil as they live in a inconsistent daydream where they can't always be what they want.   

 This is just my thoughts, but I think you could find actual teachings on this subject under the heading of svabhava in the Mahayana and bhava tanha in the Theraveda.
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stevet
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« Reply #3 on: September 15, 2009, 04:36:06 PM »

It's very nice/open of you to share that.

I forget where this came from, maybe HE TTR, but basically "we practice better when we're suffering, because we are motivated to remove it."  That has been the case with my life (extreme social anxiety and depression), and I'm sure with many others.  There's no need to feel guilty about it, maybe if we feel guilty that is just that same self-critical attitude of beating ourselves up which caused us to suffer, and consequently study dharma in the first place.  That sort of thing isn't necessary.  We should feel good about studying dharma, even if it is as "spiritual marijuana," because we are developing insight which will in the long run benefit ourselves and others.  Think about worse things:  drinking, drugs, or other samsaric ways to escape pain.  I don't think anyone should feel guilty about studying dharma, unless the motivation is directly negative, for example to make money.

Even as a human: if we're in the lower realms at the moment (suffering too much that learning dharma is impossible), or if we're in the god realms (enjoying life too much that we don't care to learn dharma), then either can be an obstacle for practice.  If we are going through troubles and dharma helps antidote them then it's very good fuel for practice, until we have a stronger urge to practice for others.  Actually it is great.

The only thing to watch out for later on:  when life is happier (which it definitely will be), are we going to stop practicing?  Will bodhicitta be strong enough by then?  Have to take the steps to prepare, because I've seen people cut off their practice, which will result in suffering later on when they start losing what they have.
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Joey
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« Reply #4 on: September 16, 2009, 06:38:16 AM »

sometimes when the memory of the suffering is too great, the person will remember it and use it as a force to move on with their practice even during happy times.

But really, what happens when one day you discovered that all your "practice" was nothing more than your fantasy and that you read Dharma books to fuel that fantasy? How would you react?
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If you propose to speak, always ask yourself, is it true, is it necessary, is it kind." ~Buddha
stevet
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« Reply #5 on: September 16, 2009, 10:45:21 AM »

But really, what happens when one day you discovered that all your "practice" was nothing more than your fantasy and that you read Dharma books to fuel that fantasy? How would you react?

Dharma is medicine against fantasy.  It doesn't matter what happened before; now you have all this knowledge of the medicine and can use that to apply  the antidote.  That's how I'd try to see it at least.  Self-bashing is also fantasy : )
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greasypalm
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« Reply #6 on: September 16, 2009, 01:59:14 PM »

The practice non-attachment helps.  When we encounter people with strong views, who are unable to accept our point of view, we should just let go and not let our ego take over us.    Dharma theory and dharma practical is so different.  What we learn in dharma - in order to be truly happy, requires practice. 

I think when we have a good knowledge of dharma and we have a genuine motivation to pass on this knowledge and we affect peoples lives positively, we can become very happy and full of ego but at the same time, we have to learn to transform this ego into an "egoless ego".
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Joey
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« Reply #7 on: September 16, 2009, 06:25:59 PM »

stevet: someone with this problem can be found in this board Smiley perhaps we can try the method on him Tongue guess who

greasypalm: but at the end of the day, what matters are the results...Rinpoche always stressed on this: "you think your Dharma practice is so good? how many people have you bring into the Dharma?"

which...well come to think of it I still have a long way to go

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If you propose to speak, always ask yourself, is it true, is it necessary, is it kind." ~Buddha
greasypalm
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« Reply #8 on: September 18, 2009, 01:20:41 PM »

stevet: someone with this problem can be found in this board Smiley perhaps we can try the method on him Tongue guess who

greasypalm: but at the end of the day, what matters are the results...Rinpoche always stressed on this: "you think your Dharma practice is so good? how many people have you bring into the Dharma?"

which...well come to think of it I still have a long way to go



Positive Results are important and yet by our fixation to positive results, we are creating cravings for it which is negative.  Rinpoche once told me that even if I were to leave a dharma literature to someone who just put it away without reading it, that piece of literature may make its way to someone else who will benefit from it later.  So we must learn how to practice non-attachment.
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Joey
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« Reply #9 on: September 18, 2009, 05:19:20 PM »

stevet: someone with this problem can be found in this board Smiley perhaps we can try the method on him Tongue guess who

greasypalm: but at the end of the day, what matters are the results...Rinpoche always stressed on this: "you think your Dharma practice is so good? how many people have you bring into the Dharma?"

which...well come to think of it I still have a long way to go



I am not sure how to put it this way but i felt that he did it to pop the ego and self-delusion that you're high and mighty in your Dharma practice, a trap that people often sink into and never get out from.
Positive Results are important and yet by our fixation to positive results, we are creating cravings for it which is negative.  Rinpoche once told me that even if I were to leave a dharma literature to someone who just put it away without reading it, that piece of literature may make its way to someone else who will benefit from it later.  So we must learn how to practice non-attachment.
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If you propose to speak, always ask yourself, is it true, is it necessary, is it kind." ~Buddha
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